Bashar contradicts himself?

A place to talk about Bashar's teachings and anything you feel is relevant to it.

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OgBashar
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Re: Bashar contradicts himself?

Post by OgBashar » Fri Jun 08, 2018 12:21 am

His reply:
Carla was a superb conscious channeler as well... I've heard her described by Jim as being one of the best ever. In the first contact with Ra it was a conscious channeling remember? Carla and L/L Research's channeling was and is about seeking the highest and best channel they could sustain and also challenging those who wish to speak on principles they would be willing to die for. This is not a channeling preparation that all or even many channelers employ. Ra said many times they are a narrow band connection... to me that means if those seeking their contact lose polarity in their seeking, Ra will no longer be available as the group will have tuned into something else. The presence and configuration of the appurtences and other preparations were all made to maximize the love and light to sustain the Ra contact which had much more stringent requirements than most do.
He takes a lot of pride in the difficulty of the channeling. Kudos to them for going through all that but from my point of view it wasn’t necessary in and of itself. It was a result of the groups beliefs. I find very little value here.
his reply:
Not only do I not like it, I can't even find the concept, nevermind the metaphor, within the Ra material anywhere. Can you or anyone perhaps show me where it is?
Harvest to fourth density STO and STS is Ra’s metaphor for the splitting of the timeline. It is quite clear. If he doesn’t see it he doesn’t want to.
]his reply:
One does not show agreement between philosophies just by saying so.


Lol, Yes I do. I know who I AM.
You could perhaps show where in the Ra material it agrees with those points, if that were possible. Following one's highest excitement from the personality shell will not let you know automatically or otherwise if you are out of alignment with one's higher self. That would be an infringement.
What Bashar says about following your highest excitement is not contained within the Ra material as far as I know. Bashar’s understanding is more complete and advanced than what was channeled in the Ra material.

There is no infringement in following your highest excitement. The infringement is in not allowing yourself to follow it due to limiting belief.
Each one's higher self is STO/Unified, being mid to late sixth density. Perhaps one who has had many incarnations of the negative pathway will have such a bias coming into incarnation, however; this one's higher self is still as positive as can be... and will provide whatever catalyst it may to help it's flagging mind/body/spirit complex, though as Ra says, all catalyst can be viewed positively or negatively. I'm not saying there is not polarity bias within one's being; but that there is a deeper core to all beings that resonates with the Law of One and the Creator. Consider that Ra said that 6th density negative entities would not dare risk the forgetting process to become wanderers. Why not? If it were confident it would maintain or perhaps increase its polarity, it wouldn't be concerned about the risk... since it is concerned, it knows there are seeds of unity within it and it could quite possibly, because of the veil of forgetting, totally repolarize to the positive/STO polarity for third density is the density of choice from behind the veil.
Here I think we are in misalignment with regards to structure mostly. As all structure is ultimately just a metaphor anyway I don’t consider his statement here to be incorrect. Where exactly the dividing lines are isn’t important. Ultimately there is only STO, there is only Love. However, I would disagree that there is choice only from within the veil. I think this is what separates us from the angels. Where the angels ultimately have no choice, we always do, even after we lift the veil. We have been given(earned) this gift, or curse, depending upon how you choose to look upon it.
his reply:
What is the difference between what Bashar is suggesting and what most people within the sinkhole of indifference are doing? I see none. The indifference, by the way, doesn't mean they are indifferent to life, it means they haven't yet made The Choice of STO or STS to meet the fourth density graduation requirements... so they are indifferent to that Choice, not to their own interests. Take someone for example who is passionate about video games... he may be very excited about it and fully following his passion, yet on average, very little work in consciousness is done toward polarizing STO or STS in most cases. Part of this is a matter of definition. Most people are in great alignment with their selves as far as their conscious personality shell is concerned... for that is where they are living their lives from.. that is what their lives are all about.. the self. Their concern or fear may be how to protect the self and what the self wants and owns from a scary world of other selves who are doing the same selfish things. There is a greater self however, that is in love and harmony with the Creator and all there is. Those on the STO path make their lives about loving the Creator in all its facets, as it is all the same Creator. The experience of the Creator's love is most keenly felt during the internal silence or meditation. It is also felt when helping others (without infringing.) This work that restores a loving relationship with the subconscious and the deeper roots of the mind is a different kind of alignment with the greater Self which is of great interest in Ra's material.
The only thing I disagree with here is his assertion about what Bashar is recommending. In his example he appears to be taking a very negative point of view of people(children) who’s passion is (playing)video games. The assumption is that there is no spiritual value in it. I believe this is an erroneous assumption although there may be exceptions. The child who’s passion for playing video games has in today’s world grown to be the adults who have advanced computer science and technology, created the internet, block chain, and digital manufacturing which has brought and is bringing more wealth into our world. All these people have done is followed their highest excitement. Following ones highest excitement IS THE MOST SPIRITUAL THING ONE CAN DO.

The bottom line here I think is he doesn’t get Bashar and doesn’t want to. He believes he already knows everything he needs to know. Personally, that is a place I never want to be as it is extremely arrogant and limiting as you leave yourself nowhere else to go with nothing else to do, kind of like the STS path itself.

I’m sure he will know that he needs to know when he needs to know it. :)

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Alice
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Re: Bashar contradicts himself?

Post by Alice » Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:41 am

Thanks OgBashar, I edited and posted there. He is "J" of course.
Really like what you say re following our excitement, that it is the most spiritual thing we can do.
It warranted caps ;)
Note my closing words and Ra quote on the meaning of STO.


J on the splitting of the timeline:
"Not only do I not like it, I can't even find the concept, nevermind the metaphor, within the Ra material anywhere. Can you or anyone perhaps show me where it is?"

Harvest to fourth density STO and STS is Ra’s metaphor for the splitting of the timeline. It is quite clear.

J:
"One does not show agreement between philosophies just by saying so."

Lol, Yes I do. I know who I AM.

J: "You could perhaps show where in the Ra material it agrees with those points, if that were possible. Following one's highest excitement from the personality shell will not let you know automatically or otherwise if you are out of alignment with one's higher self. That would be an infringement."

What Bashar says about following your highest excitement is not contained within the Ra material as far as I know.

There is no infringement in following your highest excitement. The infringement is in not allowing yourself to follow it due to limiting belief.

J:
"Each one's higher self is STO/Unified, being mid to late sixth density. Perhaps one who has had many incarnations of the negative pathway will have such a bias coming into incarnation, however; this one's higher self is still as positive as can be... and will provide whatever catalyst it may to help it's flagging mind/body/spirit complex, though as Ra says, all catalyst can be viewed positively or negatively. I'm not saying there is not polarity bias within one's being; but that there is a deeper core to all beings that resonates with the Law of One and the Creator. Consider that Ra said that 6th density negative entities would not dare risk the forgetting process to become wanderers. Why not? If it were confident it would maintain or perhaps increase its polarity, it wouldn't be concerned about the risk... since it is concerned, it knows there are seeds of unity within it and it could quite possibly, because of the veil of forgetting, totally repolarize to the positive/STO polarity for third density is the density of choice from behind the veil."

Here I think we are in misalignment with regards to structure only. As all structure is ultimately just a metaphor anyway Where exactly the dividing lines are isn’t important. Ultimately there is only STO, there is only Love.

J:
"What is the difference between what Bashar is suggesting and what most people within the sinkhole of indifference are doing? I see none. The indifference, by the way, doesn't mean they are indifferent to life, it means they haven't yet made The Choice of STO or STS to meet the fourth density graduation requirements... so they are indifferent to that Choice, not to their own interests. Take someone for example who is passionate about video games... he may be very excited about it and fully following his passion, yet on average, very little work in consciousness is done toward polarizing STO or STS in most cases. Part of this is a matter of definition. Most people are in great alignment with their selves as far as their conscious personality shell is concerned... for that is where they are living their lives from.. that is what their lives are all about.. the self. Their concern or fear may be how to protect the self and what the self wants and owns from a scary world of other selves who are doing the same selfish things. There is a greater self however, that is in love and harmony with the Creator and all there is. Those on the STO path make their lives about loving the Creator in all its facets, as it is all the same Creator. The experience of the Creator's love is most keenly felt during the internal silence or meditation. It is also felt when helping others (without infringing.) This work that restores a loving relationship with the subconscious and the deeper roots of the mind is a different kind of alignment with the greater Self which is of great interest in Ra's material."

It seems your assumption is that there is no spiritual value in, f.e., a passion for video games.. But there have been kids with this passion who have in adulthood, advanced computer science and technology, created the internet, block chain, and digital manufacturing, which is bringing more wealth into our world. All because they have followed their highest excitement. Following one's highest excitement IS THE MOST SPIRITUAL THING ONE CAN DO.

Remember, Ra said that the STO path cannot be understood from the surface meaning of the term. It is not always about serving the poor in a soup kitchen or other such obvious acts. WE can indeed be serving others as well as the self by indulging our passion for video games--for example.
IOW, you can't judge the STO book by its cover :)

"The true essence of Service To Others cannot be contained within the overt semantic description that the words provide.

It is, rather, a statement of a status of being that is arrived at once one has achieved some degree of unveiling of the conscious motivations that underlie the self.

The extent to which these motivations become conscious is the extent to which the soul has evolved.

So when we speak of conscious motivations, we speak of the more complete form of consciousness, which does include that which your peoples would normally define as sub-conscious.

To become conscious of that which motivates the self is to become aware of the choices that have been made [in life], and of the extent to which most entities have declared martial law over their own free will in their minds.

So when we state Service to Others as being the desirable path, that path has greater complexity than simply attending church or appeasing those around you and making them happy.

The Service to Others path is a path of integration of self, and through that integration of self, becoming aware to some degree that there is no separation between self and others.

This is decidedly different than one only looking as far as to see it as being a function of volunteering one’s time in such things as a soup kitchen or otherwise.

Therefore, this path is, in one sense, rather difficult to define, and any attempt to use one concept or one set of words is flawed by its very nature."

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Alice
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Re: Bashar contradicts himself?

Post by Alice » Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:19 am

And his replies so far. I let him know I was done discussing this with him, our approaches are just too different. I did recommend
he ponder the Ra quote on STO, which he doesn't address here. :mrgreen:
"Harvest to fourth density STO and STS is Ra’s metaphor for the splitting of the timeline. It is quite clear. "

J:
Where then does Ra say they are speaking metaphorically about this process? They describe the steps of light... so how is that even a metaphor for timeline shifting?... and if so it is a really bad one... so it seems you are saying Ra gives a terrible description or metaphor for a process that Bashar, a conscious channel does a much clearer job of describing. Obviously I disagree.

J:
"One does not show agreement between philosophies just by saying so."

"Lol, Yes I do. I know who I AM"... "

J: Okay... and so we should all just accept all you say, because you know that? I know you as an inexperienced Creator whose thoughts are so distorted, I have a difficult time deciding whether you are deliberately missing the point in order to attempt to tire me out, or you genuinely don't understand what I wrote.


"There is no infringement in following your highest excitement. "

J: Of course not, what I wrote was, " Following one's highest excitement from the personality shell will not let you know automatically or otherwise if you are out of alignment with one's higher self. That would be an infringement. " This means that for the higher self to let your conscious mind know automatically that it is out of alignment with the higher self would be an infringement.

"So when we speak of conscious motivations, we speak of the more complete form of consciousness, which does include that which your peoples would normally define as sub-conscious."

J:
You didn't attribute the quote, but let me guess, is it Bashar? This is in contradiction to what Ra says about the veil of forgetting between the conscious and subconscious.
92.21 Questioner: Card #2, the Potentiator of the Mind: we see a female sitting on a rectangular block. She is veiled and between two pillars which seem to be identically covered with drawings but one much darker than the other. I am assuming that the veil represents the veil between the conscious and subconscious or Matrix and Potentiator. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is quite correct.

Thanks for this quote.This is one of the most clear examples of how the philosophies of Ra and Bashar are different. The Confederation says the negative polarity deal with what is known and build their philosophy around it. It appears in this quote they even want to pretend the subconscious mysteries do not exist... as Bashar is implying "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain." This is so clearly wrong if you are familiar with the field of hypnosis or that of magic. Ra: "I am Ra. Magical ability is the ability to consciously use the so-called unconscious. Therefore, there was maximal ability prior to the innovation of sub-Logoi’s free will."
And his reply to my post saying I was done here, our approaches are too different..
likewise... though I will say that I gave an example not to say that there is no possible way to use a passion for video games in a positive spirtual sense, but rather that typically that is not done. Of course service depends most on intention... and I would only suggest that typically a passion for video games is not for the purpose of polarizing or working on will or internal/subconscious desire... and that is the only reason I used it as an example.

OgBashar
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Re: Bashar contradicts himself?

Post by OgBashar » Fri Jun 08, 2018 11:11 am

Lol. Excellent! I think he just needs an alien anal probe to loosen him up a bit. :lol:

basharelan3937
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Re: Bashar contradicts himself?

Post by basharelan3937 » Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:07 pm

Alice wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:25 pm
basharelan3937 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:46 pm
Alice wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:55 am


I don't see that anyone stopped me from doing those kinds of things, I stopped myself. Would have been nice to get more encouragement
rather than criticism (like with my creative efforts), but all part of the journey to self-validation.

Yes, in being our true selves, we heal in sim-time.
Indeed. just by being you, you naturally start healing. Forgiving them for criticizing you can help you get rid of the subtle baggage that you may be carrying in your belief system from the past but as the creator of your very own reality, it is totally up to you. :)
Yes, as I said, all part of the journey to self-validation.
Interesting. so we go through a journey of self-validation just to get to the destination that requires self-validation? they're both the same?

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Alice
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Re: Bashar contradicts himself?

Post by Alice » Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:21 pm

basharelan3937 wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:07 pm
Alice wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:25 pm
basharelan3937 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:46 pm


Indeed. just by being you, you naturally start healing. Forgiving them for criticizing you can help you get rid of the subtle baggage that you may be carrying in your belief system from the past but as the creator of your very own reality, it is totally up to you. :)
Yes, as I said, all part of the journey to self-validation.
Interesting. so we go through a journey of self-validation just to get to the destination that requires self-validation? they're both the same?
Not sure I understand your question. I thought I was pretty clear.

We go through experiences of not being supported/validated as part of our learning to support and validate ourselves.

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Alice
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Re: Bashar contradicts himself?

Post by Alice » Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:22 pm

OgBashar wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 11:11 am
Lol. Excellent! I think he just needs an alien anal probe to loosen him up a bit. :lol:
Very focused on the LoO as a mechanism for harvest to 4D. I guess he is tripping himself up right there, since he has expectations of outcome :)

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